Lazar, Taylor square off in court debate

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Wisconsin Supreme Court candidates Maria Lazar and Chris Taylor staked their claims to independence and accused one another of being too extreme for a 10-year term on the state’s highest bench during their first, and only debate of the campaign.

The debate hosted by WISN 12 in Milwaukee Thursday night was a make-up game of sorts. It was originally scheduled a week earlier at the Marquette Law School but was postponed after Taylor’s campaign announced she had been diagnosed with kidney stones. It was postponed again by one hour Thursday night because of extreme weather.

With no audience in the WISN studio, Taylor, a state appeals judge from Madison, sat beside Lazar, a state appeals judge from Brookfield. across a desk from the moderators. Throughout the evening, Lazar accused Taylor of being an activist judge due to her decade as a Democratic member of the state Assembly and, prior to that, policy director for Planned Parenthood Wisconsin.

Taylor accused Lazar of bringing a right-wing agenda to the bench and attacked one of Lazar’s rulings that was overturned by the Supreme Court’s liberal majority and conservative Justice Brian Hagedorn.
The candidates fielded a wide range of questions on local, state and national issues. This is how it shook out.

Abortion rights and restrictions have been a dominant issue in Wisconsin Supreme Court races since the U.S. Supreme Court overturned federal Roe v. Wade abortion protections in 2022. It was no different Thursday when the topic came up during a question about Taylor and Lazar’s judicial philosophies.
Taylor honed in on Lazar’s philosophy, which the conservative describes as “originalism with a touch of textualism,” and claimed Lazar believes that if “the right to abortion” wasn’t recognized in the Constitution or by society centuries ago, “it does not exist.”

Lazar countered by repeatedly committing to uphold Wisconsin’s existing 20-week abortion ban law, which she described as a “20-week compromise.” She accused Taylor of being an activist and supporting legislation to allow “abortion at any time during the entire pregnancy.”
Later, Taylor attacked Lazar for an interview with Channel 3000 shortly after launching her campaign in which she said the ruling that overturned Roe v. Wade “was actually very wise.”

“It’s not been very wise for victims of rape and incest who now live in states where abortion has been outlawed,” said Taylor.

Lazar called the comment an “absolutely ridiculous” lie.

“To say that I’m extreme, that I want women to die or suffer … my opponent has been saying that from the beginning, and that is absurd,” said Lazar. “That’s really absurd.”
When asked if she would recuse herself if any potential cases involving her former employer, Planned Parenthood, make it to the Supreme Court, Taylor said she would not.

Amid a national mid-decade redistricting arms race between states led by Democrats and Republicans, a three-judge panel in Wisconsin all but closed the door on a lawsuit seeking to redraw the state’s eight U.S. House districts ahead of the November election.

When asked if the panel made the right call and a separate panel considering a different congressional map case should do the same, neither Taylor nor Lazar would comment on the pending litigation.
Taylor did make a reference to partisan gerrymandering, though, and said it’s incredibly important “that every citizen who is eligible to vote has the right to pick their elected representatives, not the other way around.”

Taylor followed up by attacking Lazar for her stint as an assistant Wisconsin attorney general when she defended state Assembly and Senate maps passed during former Republican Gov. Scott Walker’s first term.

Lazar said while she couldn’t say what the panel in the remaining congressional map case should or shouldn’t do, “I will note that it was very unusual to send it to those panels.”

Lazar said the maps she defended on behalf of the Wisconsin Department of Justice were found to have followed the constitution.
“If you want to see a real gerrymandered map, then I propose everyone watching go look at the map of Illinois, which … looks like a giant octopus swallowing the city of Chicago,” said Lazar.

As the final days of the state Supreme Court race wind down, litigation is flying at the federal level after President Donald Trump issued an executive order that would transform the federal government’s role in how states run elections.

It directs his administration to create lists of U.S. citizens eligible to vote and have the U.S. Postal Service block absentee ballots from going to people whose names aren’t on it. At the same time, the U.S. Senate is considering legislation with similar provisions to Trump’s order.
When asked if she supports those provisions, including a possible ban on mail-in voting, Lazar said she doesn’t “stand for all the things that they’re throwing in now or talking about now federally.” Instead, she said she supports Wisconsin’s voter ID requirement and would uphold it on the Supreme Court.

Taylor, who was strongly opposed to the ID law passed by state Republicans, said it’s the law of the land, “and I will implement the law of the land.” She then attacked Lazar for previous endorsements from groups and individuals who “led the charge in trying to overturn our 2020 election.”
“And that is very alarming,” Taylor said. “She will not say whether the Trump v. Biden lawsuit that was filed in 2020 in an attempt to overturn our election, which was defeated by our state Supreme Court by one vote … was the right decision,” said Taylor.

Lazar said she is not responsible for all of the thoughts and ideas of people who have endorsed her in the past.
“Our election was valid,” said Lazar. “Joe Biden did win, and that’s the state of the law in our country. And I support that 100 percent. I think we should be looking forward. I don’t think we should be looking back.”

During a discussion about the federal arrest and conviction of Milwaukee County Circuit Court Judge Hannah Dugan on charges of helping a plaintiff in her courtroom evade federal immigration officers, Taylor and Lazar found some common ground. They wouldn’t comment on whether the jury was right to convict Dugan, but both voiced concerns about the federal government and politicians criticizing judges for rulings they don’t like.
Taylor’s response was homed in on President Trump’s administration threatening federal judges with impeachment.
“I think there’s been a real attack on the independence of judges,” said Taylor. “I am fiercely independent. I will resist any overreach by the federal government that tries to interfere in the independence of our state.”
Lazar said she also doesn’t like it to see politicians “on any side making insulting comments to the independence or decisions made by judges.”

“We all try so hard to get everything right,” said Lazar. “A judge’s life is difficult, and it does not help when you have politicians or anyone else insulting judges.”

It’s unclear whether Thursday’s debate will move the needle of public perceptions of the candidates in the race ahead of Tuesday’s election. Throughout the campaign, Marquette University Law School polling has shown voters’ awareness of the race pales in comparison to last year’s record-breaking Supreme Court race that saw $115 million in spending.

Both Lazar and Taylor are on a final barnstorming tour of Wisconsin. On Friday, Taylor will hold events in Green Bay, Appleton and Sheboygan. Lazar will hold events in Eau Claire, La Crosse and Madison.